Update: Subaru/Toyota Coupe CONFIRMED!!1!

[Mr Kleen]

Autoblog: Subaru teases Boxer Sports Car Architecture ahead of Geneva debut

http://www.subaru-global.com/boxersports.html

[Mr Kleen]

This is the Subieyota; is it AWD?

No, no it is not. But we already knew that. I don't care if it's AWD I just want a turbo and a good dif out back.







NOW SHOW US THE DAMN CAR ALREADY

[zaxrex]

All I see is Subaru and AWD

[PGT]

as much as I like those wheels and nearly bought a set for my Subaru, its odd they're using them on this application. I mean, they're almost a five year old design and this is a concept car.

[Mr Kleen]

Geneva 2011: Subaru's RWD Sports Car getting 2.0-liter non-turbo engine, confirmed for America

Still no pictures of a prototype with solid body panels. I don't mind the RWD setup but if there's no turbo I'll be looking elsewhere.

[drwrx]

I don't mind the RWD setup but if there's no turbo I'll be looking elsewhere.

Agreed. What is the point, unless it is going to under cut the price of the Genesis Coupe significantly.
I think they are doing themselves a huge disservice by not offering a turbo. The market for an under powered sports coupe isn't very large.

[Sabre]

According to Subaru: "Instead it maximises the potential of this newly developed chassis to achieve the fundamental characteristics of a rear-wheel-drive sports car by delivering sporty performance as driver and vehicle work in unison, as well as providing agile response afforded by its short wheel base.

I love to take corners as much as the next guy, but you need straight line acceleration too. Looking at the next Z, how is this thing going to compete? AWD and the STI engine is what we wanted, not this thing. I really hoped they would announce a DI variant of the STI engine with this, but I see they had different plans...

[sirwilliam]

Toyota FT-86 II Concept - 2011 Geneva Auto Show

Here at the 2011 Geneva Auto Show there were two unveilings for the concept known universally as the FT-86. The first was at Toyota, where the FT-86 II Concept made its debut. Low slung, with new curves and wearing 18-in. wheels that house large brake rotors, this is clearly a performance-oriented FT. Over at Subaru there was no complete car displayed, but the base car’s drivetrain was suspended without a chassis. A new 2.0-liter boxer 4-cylinder engine will be standard for both Toyota and Subaru variants.

A discussion with Subaru Program Group Manager Toshio Masuda answered our questions about the continuing development. To begin, the car is not slated for sale until 2012. It will be front engine, rear-wheel drive. The position of the engine low in the chassis precludes all-wheel drive without a complete redesign. Compared to a WRX, the flat-4 of the FT is 4.7 in. lower and 9.4 in. closer to the passenger compartment. This lowers the car’s center of gravity and reducing its polar moment of inertia—all pluses for a sports car. The engine is flanked by MacPherson strut suspension, and in the rear are double A-arms.

From the Toyota FT-86 concept II we can predict a wheelbase of 101.2 in., a length of 166.7 in., a width of 70.7 in. and a height of 50.0. In other words, it’s a compact car, even for a 2+2 coupe. We haven’t been told a weight yet, but the FT-86 is predicted to be 20 percent lighter than a WRX STI. This translates to a curb weight just below 2800 pounds. Not quite as light as a Miata, but with a power output around 180 the FT-86 should be nearly as quick as that little sports car.

For a performance handling benchmark, Masuda chose the Porsche Cayman. A lofty goal for a car expected to be priced near $24,000. We can only hope it stays in that price range. The base model could hit that mark. It will be equipped with 215/45R-17 tires all around and likely come standard with a 6-speed manual, but it was clear the company was investigating other transmission options. The seating position will be kept low, and the focus is to make the driving experience fun.

As other details emerge, we will report more on this exciting new rear-drive sports coupe. Our fondest hope is that it lives up to our enthusiast expectations, and with the rumor that it drives like a 2+2 Mazda Miata, it should be perfect. Time however, will only tell.

[Sabre]

Not quite as light as a Miata, but with a power output around 180 the FT-86 should be nearly as quick as that little sports car.

...

For a performance handling benchmark, Masuda chose the Porsche Cayman.

Looks GREAT and I really hope they deliver. Very sad to hear that the Subie won't be AWD... Subaru is walking a fine line with this and their advertising campaign in the US.

[complacent]

i think it looks absolutely stunning.

i think it is way underpowered.

wow, what a looker!

[drwrx]

Not quite as light as a Miata, but with a power output around 180 the FT-86 should be nearly as quick as that little sports car.

...

For a performance handling benchmark, Masuda chose the Porsche Cayman.

Gee, "nearly" as quick as a Miata.

And, no offense, while the handling benchmark of the Cayman is a good target, it's not that lofty. The EVO IX matches it around most tracks. Much of the Cayman's "balance" can be attributed to it's mid engine, something any FE RD car will not be able to duplicate.

[zaxrex]

Shifting the engine 10" towards the rear and eliminating half the garbox must open up a lot of space to work with.
If you can turbo a Miata, then you can turbo this thing.
Aftermarket fabricators, get your CAD-CAM face on.

[Sabre]

Shifting the engine 10" towards the rear and eliminating half the garbox must open up a lot of space to work with.
If you can turbo a Miata, then you can turbo this thing.
Aftermarket fabricators, get your CAD-CAM face on.

Oh, I definitely agreed! I noticed they said "new 2.0l engine"... makes me wonder if they are going to use this to launch some kind of 9k rpm, DI beast.

[zaxrex]

We are talking about Subaru here.
We will probably get the diesel here before something performance based.
Lower you expectations.

[Sabre]

[Mr Kleen]

I imagine they'll launch an STi version after a year or two, depending on sales figures. I never had any real thought that any version would have AWD. This car is all about packaging that flat 4 as far back as possible. But considering how long this car has taken to come to market, how much longer will I have to wait for a turbo? What if it doesn't catch on in the first place?

The Miata is a fantastic car but it's power shortcomings are mitigated somewhat by the fact that THE ROOF COMES OFF IN NICE WEATHER! An entire industry sprang up to offer the power that Mazda just flat out refuses to put into any of the great chassis they engineer. But I wouldn't be quick to turbo an NA car. If it's a used Miata, sure, why not? But a brand new $20,000 car? Maybe better wait till that warranty is up to think about aftermarket turbos.

I think the FT86's nose is a bit overwrought, but I also said that about the Aston One-77, so take that as you will.

I'll be investigating BMW and Audi showrooms when I head to Germany next month.
Sorry Subaru, maybe next time...

[zaxrex]

Many times I wondered how many trips I would need to bring back enough pieces of a diesel A3 and make a full car. At least drive one for me, Gabe.

Oh, and if we are to believe MSN Auto journalists (Copy and Paste queens) A rear-drive, front-engine sports car, the FT-86 is the result of an alliance with Subaru. Power will be provided by a Subaru boxer engine, likely a 2.0-liter turbocharged four...

[GaToR]

Many times I wondered how many trips I would need to bring back enough pieces of a diesel A3 and make a full car. At least drive one for me, Gabe.

Isn't there an A3 TDI sold in the States? Granted, no quattro...

Odd (very odd) that Audi sells the A3 TDI, the A3 quattro, but not a combination of the twain. Would be pricey to pick up a used A3 and swap the 2.0TDI into it.

[Raven]

The Miata is a fantastic car but it's power shortcomings are mitigated somewhat by the fact that THE ROOF COMES OFF IN NICE WEATHER!

Disagree, the lack of power is mitigated by driver involvement. The car is so precise and tactile. The fact that it lacks power isn't an issue, you just rev the nuts off it and enjoy the noise.

I love my miata, but as my only car it's just a bit too hardcore. The noise at highway cruising speed is just crazy and trunk is just a bit too small to take two people and luggage. Also, the short wheelbase makes it pretty tricky when you push it hard.

If the FT-86 is able to drive like a miata I'd strongly consider it. It'll offer just enough practicality to be easy to live with as my only car.

[complacent]

I love my miata, but as my only car it's just a bit too hardcore. The noise at highway cruising speed is just crazy and trunk is just a bit too small to take two people and luggage. Also, the short wheelbase makes it pretty tricky when you push it hard.

If the FT-86 is able to drive like a miata I'd strongly consider it. It'll offer just enough practicality to be easy to live with as my only car.

hogwash! i drove mine for five solid years and every time i turned the key i drove it as though it were stolen. looking back, they were five of my all-time best driving years.

my sincere advice is to relish in its' inadequacies. learn to love the fact that it's either a date or the grocery store. learn to love that noise all around you at highway speeds. it's there to remind you that you're supposed to be having fun!

you truly have to be able to 100% love the constraints that help to make it such a focused car. i think (know?) that the eunos roadster is one of the best sports cars ever built. i also believe every car enthusiast has to own one at one point in their life.

[Raven]

Don't get me wrong, I love driving it and I don't want it to be quiet. It's just the insane wind noise over the top at highway cruising speed that really irks me. I love the sound of the engine and the whine of the gearbox. But after about an hour on the highway you just want the wind to shut up.

[sirwilliam]

more pics

[PGT]

wondering why this over a Genesis Coupe?

[Sabre]

^^^ I'm sure that will be a competitor... should be interesting to see who comes out on top!

BTW, I'm really digging the pictures above! Flat black it and

[complacent]

BTW, I'm really digging the pictures above! Flat black it and

a lot of this. car looks hawt.