DCAWD.com

Maybe GM's getting it's act together at just the right time:

AutoBlog wrote:...The heart of the Cobalt SS Turbo is its engine, a turbocharged, direct-inject version of the same 2.0L Ecotec in the first-gen car that now produces 260 horsepower and 260 lb-ft of torque. It is the Alpha and Omega of the Ecotec engine family and a marvel of modern engineering. Available since 2008 in the Cobalt SS Turbo and HHR SS, and also in the Pontiac Solstice GXP and Saturn Sky Red Line, the turbo DI Ecotec does now what Ford promises its EcoBoost engines will do in a few years. That is, produce V6 power with four-cylinder fuel economy. Case in point, the Cobalt SS Turbo returns 30 mpg on the highway.

...The first sign you haven't mistakenly gotten in a Cobalt LT is that the clutch pedal is firm and pushes back hard against your left foot, while the chunky five-speed stick follows a very precise path into each gear. It feels nothing like the cream puff clutch and sloppy shifter you would expect in a Yankee-built economy car, but like a strict German couple adopted the Cobalt SS and raised it as their own.

...Individual components aside, it's how these parts all work together that makes the Cobalt SS Turbo better than the sum of its spec sheet. Out and about it won't let you forget its purpose, as the act of driving takes more effort from your left leg and right arm than most cars. You best hold the steering firmly at all times, too, since all that power going through the front wheels will try to wrest it from your hands while powering out of a turn at any speed.

...it's got things like a limited-slip differential to keep one of the front wheels from spinning during a corner, and a super trick "no-lift shift" feature that allows you to change gears without lifting your foot off the gas. It even has a launch control mode for perfect, repeatable launches that will hold the revs at 5,000 rpm and use traction control to keep the front wheels at the precipice of wheel spin.

Would you like to know moar?

--Alan

WRXWagon2112 wrote:Maybe GM's getting it's act together at just the right time:

AutoBlog wrote:"no-lift shift" feature that allows you to change gears without lifting your foot off the gas.
Would you like to know moar?

--Alan

That's pretty nifty. I wonder if you can turn it off for double-clutching, etc. I've been mildly impressed by the Cobalt SS before, but this one sounds pretty trick. Still wouldn't trap myself in the plastic death of the interior though.

Nigel Powers wrote:There are two kinds of people I can't stand in this world. People who are intolerant of other people's cultures, and the Dutch.

As much as I'd like to say "sure I'll give anything a shot" I'm very hesitant to buy into the idea that american car companies are starting to turn it around.

I still think the damn thing is a cavalier.

They really need to shake that image/quality/feel problem.

Or maybe I just hate american cars too much. Dunno. Too cynical?

the Cobalt SS outperformed more than a few cars in Car and Driver's Lightning Lap 2008, a running of the 4.2 mile VIR Grand Course.

the following cars finished behind the SS lap time of 3:13.0/78.3mph:
Lancer Evo MR
BMW 135i
Lexus IS F
Audi S5
Honda S2000CR
Dodge Challernger SRT8
Lotus Elise SC
Infiniti G37 Sport
Subaru Impreza WRX STi
Dodge Calibur SRT4
VW R32
Honda Civic Mugen Si
Volvo C30 T5 v2.0

complacent wrote:Too cynical?

YOU??!?!?!

Road and Track chose the new 2009 Cobalt SS 4 door over the new WRX, Mazdaspeed, and Lancer Ralliart...

Want to know moar?

I would still never buy a Cobalt regardless.

my interest in such a potentially captivating automobile comes to a grinding halt every time i see this.



i just can't do it.











chicken n waffles' comment does not apply to corvettes

chicken n waffles wrote:chicken n waffles' comment does not apply to corvettes

does not equal


But I have to agree. Any car who's base model is offered at most rental car companies loses respect right off the bat.

no bow tie anywhere on the 'Vette.

I try to keep an open mind about these things. if it's good and i like (or at least can tolerate) the interior and exterior styling, I'll give anybody a shot. new CTS? sure! new Genesis sedan? why not! new Cobalt SS? if I were in the market for a cheap sporty car I'd give it a test drive for sure.

how will domestic manufacturers improve if you say "no matter what you build I won't buy it?"

Mr Kleen wrote:no bow tie anywhere on the 'Vette.

Well, technically it is on the flag on the corvette emblem...but I know you meant just plain ugly bowtie all over the place.

I'm a bit torn over the Cobalt SS. I read the Car and Driver Lightning Lap article and followed the Cobalt's write-up and numbers quite closely. I was was shocked and impressed. I also rear Road and Track's article with the Cobalt SS against the new 09 WRX, Lancer Ralliart, and Mazdaspeed 3. The cobalt won the competition by a very narrow margin: 582.6 total points vs. 374.3 for the WRX, and 371.3 for the Mazdaspeed 3. The Ralliart came in last in nearly every test as well as the scoring at 347.

The Cobalt was:
2nd 0-60: 5.4 (WRX was 1st: 5.1)
2nd 1/4 mile: 13.9 @ 104 (WRX was 1st 13.8 @ 101),
2nd in the autocross: 46.62 sec. (WRX was 1st: 46.46 sec.).
1st in lateral .92g (WRX was 2nd .88g),
1st in slalom speed 70.0 mph (WRX was 3rd 67.0 mph)
2nd in breaking 121 ft. 60-0 / 214 80-0 (WRX was 3rd 124 ft. 60-0 / 220 80-0)
2nd in fuel economy 20.4 mpg (WRX was 1st 22.2 mpg)

Here's my problem, and comes right at the end of the article after a long praise of the Cobalt's long list of pluses:
"It just doesn't have the quality feel of the others." "The plastics, fabric, seats are just not up to snuff here." "The lack of proper cubbies is annoying." "And then there is the exterior. Despite the racy forged wheels and the front air dam, it still just looks like a Cobalt, which is bland with a capital "B."

To quote Patrick Hong (Senior Technical Editor), "The Cobalt's power and handling prowess was a surprise. But it's fit and finish and overall quality, as well as it's occasional odd, disjointed feel while cornering are enough for me to take a pass. I would give the nod to the WRX for it's balance of sportiness, styling and much higher quality feel. The WRX exudes the utmost confidence and maturity, either being tossed into corners or cruising the interstate."

Also, while the price difference between the Cobalt at $22,775 and the WRX at $25,495 ($2,720) is at first glance a bit steep, I would happily pay the extra sum for all-wheel drive and better quality.

Don't get me wrong, I'm very impressed with the Cobalt SS. It just won't ever end up in my garage.

I was even mildly-impressed what they did with the old cobalt SS and this is definitely impressive.... but I don't understand what Chevy is trying to accomplish with this. It's like taking an unpopular nerd at school who always gets picked last for gym and pumping him full of steroids. Sure he can now bench more than the star football player or jump higher than the best basketball player... (you get the analogy) but you still end up with a nerd who, despite his bulging muscles is still the same inside. Let the cobalt be what it is and don't try to shove it into a new role.

Also sticking with the "nerd" analogy... can you imagine the EGO!?. I predict a whole new wave of "elitist" Cobalt SS snobs who will always start an argument with "Well the Cobalt beat your _______ around the Nurburgring". Of course that's once they actually figure out what the Nurburgring is.

In closing: DO NOT WANT

I think Mister Daithi puts it pretty well. I'm not a huge fan of any car that has a completely unsporting younger "brother". I want something sporting through and through!

Somehow I wrote over this post with the one below. I meant to reply

my point was that, in my opinion, a true "car guy" should evaluate each car on it's own merit. if we bash a car strictly because it's GM (or Mistu, or Ford or what ever) we might as well have a Calvin-pissing-on-_____ sticker.

sure the interior fit and finish of the Cobalt isn't quite up to the Japanese standard but you have to admit that the Cobalt SS is a HUGE improvement over the Cavalier of old. maybe I'm off base but the fact that GM has 3 really good cars (the Cobalt, the CTS and the Corvette) gives me some hope for the future of domestic auto manufacturers.

am I all alone here?

definitely not. the ss is a far cry from its little brother. there is a stigma attached to domestic econoboxes though, especially cavaliers/cobalts, that will be difficult for gm to shake. joe sixpack (see what i did there?) probably won't care, but the tuning community will.

that said, the current iteration of the cobalt ss is impressive and worth a look. interior fit and finish is a matter of opinion in econoboxes with forced injection. couldn't be any worse than some imprezas.

Something I didn't pick up on, but one of the commenters did:

Quote:
look at the 2008 Vet Z51 vs. [2006] Z06 -- same time.

Uhhh.... skillz?

I just take each years' Lightning Lap with a grain of salt. I'll hold off before I believe the Cobalt SS is the fastest car for under 45K.

I'm very pleased that the Cobalt SS is as strong a performer as it is, I really am.
And if there was a proven aftermarket of performance upgrades for it at the price point that it sits in it would be great!
I would be the first to cheer for a Cobalt that runs a 12.4 1/4 mile at 115 mph, that can also stop and turn on a dime with just a handful of bolt-ons and a tune. Perhaps this industry already exists and I'm just not aware of it.

However, when it comes to me dropping $23k of my money the Cobalt SS is just not on my radar, sorry.
Now, 2 years from now I might consider a used one for $13k. That would be a buy.
But to be honest, I also don't think I'm the Cobalt's target audience.

drwrx wrote:I'm very pleased that the Cobalt SS is as strong a performer as it is, I really am.

...

However, when it comes to me dropping $23k of my money the Cobalt SS is just not on my radar, sorry.

Yeah. Agreed on the notion of a Cobalt. However, I am pleased with anything that will bring the Auto industry back into the days of double-four-barrel carbs and 427's, even if in spirit. The new Cuda will be a travesty, but it will at least have stonkin tree pulling torque. I think the ZR-1 and Z06 are great examples of this, the STI and EVO (remember how long we coveted these cars from afar?) and now we finally have the Skyline.

My main concern is of course the gas market. Gasoline is coming down (our guys from wpafb tell us gas is $2.60 up there!!), but will it come down enough that cars can have serious power and still sell? I know there are lots of tricks like pneumatic valves (this is a yamaha thing, right?), desmo valves (who else), solenoid valves (GM), variable cam timing (everyone), alternate-cylinder-firing (gm first, but I think chrysler does now too) that reduce the overall gas consumption, but is it really enough? I think it's a good sign that the Corvette (at least the C5 and early C6) didn't suffer the "gas guzzler tax" because in sixth gear it was loafing along at 1100rpm at 70. Maybe, for that matter, it's intelligent transmission design and more gears (damn, I want a 7th gear in the STI).

Or maybe I've really digressed.



edit: and speaking of desmo, the desmosedici makes 200 hp from 998cc's. maybe we should work on 3-litre, 600hp motors (and that's without a turbo).

avriette wrote: edit: and speaking of desmo, the desmosedici makes 200 hp from 998cc's. maybe we should work on 3-litre, 600hp motors (and that's without a turbo).

A lot of fun can be had with a litre or less

I have a buddy that works for Gm and he had an ss and i took it for a spin. Iwas very impressed ,yes it is plasticky and yes its not that eyecatching but it performed very well ( so much that i got pulled over) . since emy wife owns a gm car ( saturn l200) that has almost 200,000 miles on it and has had no issues i am not too to worried about gm reliablity. At this time i problably wouldnt buy one becuase i am in a different stage in life ,but i am not ruling out on getting some type of gm car in the future at least putting one on my list as well as subies hondas and such.

boomee wrote:I have a buddy that works for Gm and he had an ss and i took it for a spin. Iwas very impressed ,yes it is plasticky and yes its not that eyecatching but it performed very well ( so much that i got pulled over)

I've now been passed twice by extremely aggressive cobalt SS owners on the bike. You really have to wonder about the type of driver it takes to get right on the ass-end of a supersport, linger for a minute, and then swerve to pass at 30+ over the limit (I generally don't stray above 10 over). Both were yellow with widebody kids and loud exhaust. Not sure whether it was the same car – one was in Maryland (MacArthur Blvd), and the other was literally in the North Pentagon parking lot – but it's almost like there's a new CRX SI out there, inspiring PFY's to do evil things on the road. I've never seen kids in Subarus or even Evos do that. I certainly never tried to goad bikes into racing when I was that young and stupid.

I suppose I was an evil PFY one day, so maybe there's hope for them (or, considering myself, maybe there isn't...), but I'm starting to wonder who's feeding who: the high-horsepower cars being produced, or the power-hungry consumers buying them.

complacent wrote:

avriette wrote: edit: and speaking of desmo, the desmosedici makes 200 hp from 998cc's. maybe we should work on 3-litre, 600hp motors (and that's without a turbo).

A lot of fun can be had with a litre or less

Problem is, it's probably making less than 100lbs/ft, which is not good for a car. Add a turbo and you're going to help it though. The maitinance alone would kill it in any car application though. Trust me, I want it just as bad as you all do, I just don't think we're quite there.

Back to the Cobalt SS: I'm VERY happy to see it perform so well. It has a terrible image which they are not helping with the plastic materials inside. Hopefully they will come around in this department too. People didn't like the SRT-4's when they first came out for the same reasons, yet there are plenty of them running people down on the drag strip and road courses. Let's be honest, take any car, mod it how you want and you'll be able to run down 90% of the street cars out there.