Who wants exhaust headers?

zaxrex · Post by **zaxrex** » Fri Sep 09, 2005 6:38 pm

E-bay cheap header
Slip joints and good looking welds...

zaxrex · Post by **zaxrex** » Mon Sep 12, 2005 1:19 pm

new wrapped Borla
thought I would pass this along as well.

Tom Sullivan · Post by **Tom Sullivan** » Mon Sep 12, 2005 2:27 pm

what exactly is an EGT bung, and would i need one on my sti?

Post by **Sabre** » Mon Sep 12, 2005 3:04 pm

Tom Sullivan wrote:what exactly is an EGT bung, and would i need one on my sti?

EGT= Exhaust Gas Temperature. It's useful to measure when you are tuning your car. You don't need one yet

Tom Sullivan · Post by **Tom Sullivan** » Mon Sep 12, 2005 3:24 pm

at what point in time would you need one?

after what mods you think?

Post by **complacent** » Mon Sep 12, 2005 3:34 pm

It depends on your modding route. If you plan to cover all the "bolt on's" first (tbe, headers, intake, fmic, etc) WITHOUT engine management, I would say do it soon and make sure you're not breaking 1700 degrees. If you're going to do engine management first, do it first as well.

You can get away without monitoring things like EGT if you are lightly modded. A TBE for example doesn't warrant an EGT. Nor should an intake. But once you start talking about altering intake/exhaust flow more than about 15%, it's beyond what the factory ECU can compensate for (as it has been explained to me).

Hope this helps

Post by **ElZorro** » Mon Sep 12, 2005 4:29 pm

http://www.dcawd.com/Encyclopedia/dicti ... ument_view

Any more thoughts on the subject?

zaxrex · Post by **zaxrex** » Mon Sep 12, 2005 4:55 pm

Installing a set of headers that increase flow efficiency lowers the header exhasut gas temperature. That does not have a direct correlation to lowering the combustion temperature in the cyl, but allows the gas to cool more quickly once the exhaust valves pop open. That can decrease the cooling requirements for the engine block.

gsx-lex · Post by **gsx-lex** » Tue Sep 13, 2005 3:16 am

EGT monitoring is a good safe guard against seriously damaging your engine, but not nesessarily a primary tuning tool. I've had Blitz EGT for over 2 years and have still to install it.

Post by **Sabre** » Tue Sep 13, 2005 11:40 am

bluscooby23 wrote:It depends on your modding route. If you plan to cover all the "bolt on's" first (tbe, headers, intake, fmic, etc) WITHOUT engine management, I would say do it soon and make sure you're not breaking 1700 degrees. If you're going to do engine management first, do it first as well.

I thought we were supposed to stay under 1600???

To put it all together, EGT's are important if you are tuning. First mods should be a TBE followed by engine management. The FMIC/Intake should definitely wait till you get some form of engine management.

gsx-lex · Post by **gsx-lex** » Tue Sep 13, 2005 10:24 pm

IMHO, the egt is an after product of other things that should be monitored when tuning (ie timing, knock, Airflow/Rev, AF, etc). If all these things are in order, you should be ok on pump fuel.

There are things that help raise EGT that aren't possible to be monitored like carbon buildup, but carbon buildup can cause erratic detonation which can be observed through a knock sensor.

Realistically, we can't monitor all these things while daily driving (unless you are a nerd like me and log every time you get into your car , even if it is a trip to the grocery store ). This is where I think an EGT comes in handy...

in refernece to the headers, they've been making header for dsms for quite some time, and everyone i know that's used them, absolutely hates them. Looking at those pictures though, maybe the've got teir act together. With such a low price, I might be tempted to try a set.

-lex

gsx-lex · Post by **gsx-lex** » Tue Sep 13, 2005 10:30 pm

sabre wrote: I thought we were supposed to stay under 1600???

The trend is to stay below 900 deg Celsuis which my handy temperature widget (thank you apple) tells me is around 1650 deg F. Most people keep it well under 1600 deg F.

Post by **Sabre** » Wed Sep 14, 2005 2:44 pm

gsx-lex wrote: Realistically, we can't monitor all these things while daily driving (unless you are a nerd like me and log every time you get into your car , even if it is a trip to the grocery store ). This is where I think an EGT comes in handy...

lol, I thought I was the only one who logged so much, haha....

I agree with your analysis BTW. I watch my WB02 and knock readings to get an idea of how my car is doing. I have an EGT installed, but not hooked up (need to get someone to weld a bung for me), but I plan on using that really to make sure nothing terribly wrong has gone on with the WB02. If my WB is reading ok, but I see my temps start to rise too much, I'll know something is up with the WB

zaxrex · Post by **zaxrex** » Fri Sep 16, 2005 7:39 pm

I think the subar crowd is a little different from the DSM crowd. Headers for EJ series engines are important in some applications. For stock turbo and quick spool up, the factory ones are perfect.

Since the EJ engines are spitting out gasses at two sides, there is a lot of header that is needed to join everything together before the turbo. That is why I think that the header for Subarus have a different effect than on in-line cyl cars.

From my own personal experience with a slightly upgraded turbo is that the headers made a pronounced rise in the HP and torque at higher RPMs and slowed the spool up by a few hundred RPMs.

Phil (TurboXS & Element Tuning) complementid me on my setup and said that my car performed like some that he had seen with larger turbos.

I am a header believer.

Mr Kleen · Post by **Mr Kleen** » Fri Sep 16, 2005 8:38 pm

personally I just hate to give up that "boxer rumble." I'm not going much further with the power adders, but I dig getting more info on all things car related.

after spending a weekend at a NASA Summit Point HPDE with Phil I have to say I got a good vibe from that guy. I don't know much about how he does business, but he is a hella-cool down to earth guy.

Post by **Sabre** » Sun Sep 18, 2005 5:14 pm

Mr Kleen wrote:personally I just hate to give up that "boxer rumble." I'm not going much further with the power adders, but I dig getting more info on all things car related.

You don't have to give it up

Equal length headers will give you that nice Honda sound, while unequal length (like I have) keep that nice boxer rumble.

Mr Kleen wrote: after spending a weekend at a NASA Summit Point HPDE with Phil I have to say I got a good vibe from that guy. I don't know much about how he does business, but he is a hella-cool down to earth guy.

He seems to be doing pretty well on the business side of things. I think that his tunes come out VERY safe, which also mean richer and less HP than some. When you look at the miles that I put on my car though, that means alot.

zaxrex · Post by **zaxrex** » Mon Sep 19, 2005 1:24 am

Mr Kleen wrote:after spending a weekend at a NASA Summit Point HPDE with Phil I have to say I got a good vibe from that guy. I don't know much about how he does business, but he is a hella-cool down to earth guy.

I think you hit the nail on the head. When TurboXS was his employer, he did his good work, and others made the business descisions, limiting what he could and couldn't do.

I would give my experience with Phil while at TurboXS a B, or B-. Since he has left, I hear he is doing A to B work, while in my opinion TurboXS service has gone straigh to the D-F range.

Post by **Sabre** » Mon Sep 19, 2005 4:45 pm

Mr Kleen wrote:after spending a weekend at a NASA Summit Point HPDE with Phil I have to say I got a good vibe from that guy. I don't know much about how he does business, but he is a hella-cool down to earth guy.

zaxrex wrote: I would give my experience with Phil while at TurboXS a B, or B-. Since he has left, I hear he is doing A to B work, while in my opinion TurboXS service has gone straigh to the D-F range.

I'd give Phil a A-. I still had a little bit of tuning to do with my car after his tune. He spent all of the time doing boost condition tuning and none fixing my startup or wavy throttle problem. Honestly though, I didn't mind. The underboost stuff is the hard stuff to tune. I learned ALOT by tuning out the other stuff.

I haven't heard much good about TurboXS lately either. I hope times improve for them.