DCAWD.com

Mr Kleen wrote:Report: No AWD for Subaru version of FT-86 "Toyobaru"

*unsubscribes*

Only if is legal for the car to be driven like this 80% of the time is it ok NOT to have AWD.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XHvwAKlC ... r_embedded[/video]

That being said, can you imagine the aftermarket demand for driveline conversion? That is if the designers don't make it imposible...

zaxrex wrote:Only if is legal for the car to be driven like this 80% of the time is it ok NOT to have AWD.That being said, can you imagine the aftermarket demand for driveline conversion? That is if the designers don't make it imposible...

lol, agreed! That is a very interesting question about the driveline conversion. There would definitely be a lot involved in it, and I wouldn't want to be the first since it could very well upset the balance of the car.

If AWD were possible Subaru would be doing it.
I'm not hung up on AWD, but I will only be interested if there's a turbo.

Based on what I see in that video....


Never has a car been in such desperate need of some aggressive fender flares..

The minimalizm speaks to me
It says "get this god-awful paint off of me!"

I am most perplexed as to why Toyota is doing a join venture with subaru. It's not like Toyota has no idea how to build a sports car or has no good engines.

Okay, maybe I am wrong but did I not see FMIC on this in that GT5 video?

Raven wrote:I am most perplexed as to why Toyota is doing a join venture with subaru. It's not like Toyota has no idea how to build a sports car or has no good engines.

Considering Toyota owns something like 17% of Fuji Heavy Industries it makes sense why they are playing nice with Subaru.

Raven wrote:It's not like Toyota has no idea how to build a sports car...

multimillion dollar Lexus experiments aside, when is the last time Toyota built anything that could be described as a sports car?

sirwilliam wrote:Okay, maybe I am wrong but did I not see FMIC on this in that GT5 video?

Intercooler are having in the front. But this is no way a factory car, so I wouldn't get my hopes up of something that big and open. Crash test rating would take a dive.

Who wants to bet the car is 'off-again' in 2010?


Subaru just should have built an Impreza coupe.

Building a sports car from the ground up was something Subaru couldn't pull off alone, and Toyota takes 8 years to pull off, even when they throw millions of dollars at it.

I know there were some with dreams of an AE86 revival, or an S2000 successor, but they are such a niche vehicle that they can't ever be a company's #1 priority.

Mr Kleen wrote:multimillion dollar Lexus experiments aside, when is the last time Toyota built anything that could be described as a sports car?

The Celica, the Supra, the MR2?

Raven wrote:

Mr Kleen wrote:multimillion dollar Lexus experiments aside, when is the last time Toyota built anything that could be described as a sports car?

The Celica, the Supra, the MR2?

and when was the last time you could walk into a Toyota dealership and buy a brand new Supra or MR2? (with 1 notable exception the Celica was FWD and therefore NOT a sports car.)
the Supra has been out of production for eight years, and even if you consider the MR2 Spyder to be a sports car it's been out of production for 3 years. the last MR2 that I would call a "sports car" rolled off the line in 1999. Toyota makes some great people movers and they have some great history, but they haven't been in the sports business for a long time.

Raven wrote:The Celica, the Supra, the MR2?

Me know Gabe. Methinks the use of italics negates those for a chosen reason.
He makes a compelling argument that golf and bowling are sports whereas gymnastics and figure-skating are not...

Mr Kleen wrote:and when was the last time you could walk into a Toyota dealership and buy a brand new Supra or MR2? (with 1 notable exception the Celica was FWD and therefore NOT a sports car.)
the Supra has been out of production for eight years, and even if you consider the MR2 Spyder to be a sports car it's been out of production for 3 years. the last MR2 that I would call a "sports car" rolled off the line in 1999. Toyota makes some great people movers and they have some great history, but they haven't been in the sports business for a long time.

No true Scotsman would consider those a sports car.

shades of grey

remember all the 'non car people' out there.
there's a 'sports car' for everyone.

-scheherazade

Not only is there a sports car for everyone, in large part, 'real' sports cars aren't for anyone. I'm not knocking minimalism as a principle, just as a movement it has no purchasing weight behind it. And manufacturers are learning that 'car people' are a vocal minority.

GT-type cars outsell true sports cars on an order of like 10:1.

It is a very confusing market. Millions of 'car people' in the US demand that they be built.
"All will be right in the world, so long as light cars are on the roads."
But whenever one hits the market, they undersell by 50% or worse.
"What? I didn't mean I was actually going to buy one. I just wanted it built so I could imagine myself in one if I had the money and time to have a weekend toy."

- only a fraction of us would ever actually pull the trigger on one, since we don't have the money or time
- since they aren't technological showpieces, nobody minds having a used one. A 5-year old one is just as good.
- those that do have them, they last forever since few people use them as DD's....

Marketed demographic, price, and design delays all go up.

Autocar wrote:...
But the R&D team is now more focused on minimizing fuel consumption and producing the cleanest engine possible;...
The hike in the cost moves the FT-86 further away from the original concept of a cheap, entry-level sports car...
Tetsuya Tada, told Autocar that his team had increased the target age group by 10 years, from the 30s to 40s, after market research revealed that fewer younger buyers would opt for the sleek coupé than first thought.

Ahrrrghh!!! To the last part especially.
What, now we are going to have this marketed to us as the "Mid-life crisis car that you r wife won't get too mad over because of it's green-ness?"?
This project is seeing its sunset years of Death by Committee. And it makes me sad.

Wow, not the way I wanted to see this go

This car never had much of a chance at any sort of a real life.

Toyota FTL.

This and the accelerator pedal issue is why you don't let accountants run companies.

My inside source at Toyota corporate told me Subaru supposedly did not want to do this project. He didn't elaborate.

Also, on my block at work, and woman drove a '91 ES300 into a building today, due to a floor mat trapping the accelerator.

For anyone keeping track, it's off again . And if it comes back this time, it will probably suck.

Additionally, ToMoCo is reportedly gauging the success of the Honda CR-Z, which could influence the final drivetrain specs of the FT-86.

I'm generally a fan of Honda engineering (I've owned 2 CRXs and a Civic Si) but the CR-Z sucks! I just knew Toyota wouldn't make a sporty car again.

hell, we may well be seeing the first stages of the end of a golden age...